The literary legend GaryIndiana and his friend ChrisKraus got together virtually to talk about art-world fuckery and the reprint of the sleazy-genius book 'Rent Boy' 📚 From our Spring 2023 issue.
, the old friends got together virtually to talk about what you can and can’t say out loud in the current climate, art-world fuckery, and those gone but not forgotten.INDIANA: I’m okay. Can you see me okay?INDIANA: Yeah, it was.
INDIANA: It was striking, to me, that suddenly you had friends that were just scattered. That was the thing also, that something that had been INDIANA: Of course, the con artist today is taken for granted as a model of success. Anybody can be a con artist now and not only get away with it, but be celebrated for it.
INDIANA: Exactly. Because you find, among equally talented people, that luck and connections play such a vital role in who gets to be known and who doesn’t. Some people just aren’t wired to be social and shrewd about certain connections. It’s not a question of who’s right or wrong. It’s just a question of how you’re put together.
INDIANA: Actually the people who might have been enraged by it were by that time people that I had no more contact with. Most of these things were observed from a distance or from what other people had told me. I always cultivated friendships with the lesser partner in these relationships, always the one that had to cook the meals and clean up. Those were the people that I considered my friends, not the stars.
INDIANA: I invented most of the scenes that are, let’s say over the top, like the intervention. When they do the intervention on the guy, I wasn’t there. I don’t know anything about it.
. Everybody knew who everybody was in that novella. It was considered really harsh, satirically very pointed, but if you read it today, you’d have absolutely no idea who those people were. And yet it’s still a really good work of art.INDIANA: Absolutely. If I thought about it at all, I thought that the people in the book were containers for certain kinds of pathology and characterological flaws. But it is a satire. It’s not meant to be a full portrait of anybody’s inner self.
INDIANA: We spoke recently about [writer] Heather Lewis who was the model for the character of Caroline. I loved her very much, from the first time I met her. She was so amazingly intelligent and human, in a way that moved me throughout the whole time I knew her. The trajectory of that character in the book is that I didn’t want Heather to die, so I wanted to bring her back to life.
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